1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

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Dirtdoctor
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1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by Dirtdoctor » Sun Sep 06, 2020 3:23 pm

Bought this because of interesting large number of die cracks, and perhaps breaks. S appears to be strongly doubled and perhaps tripled. Multiple cracks and/or breaks at date and along left stars. I did not see any other cataloged VAMs with these attributes. C3 Reverse. Is this submittable?
Attachments
Date.jpg
Date.jpg (193.81 KiB) Viewed 698 times
Tripled S.jpg
Tripled S.jpg (184.94 KiB) Viewed 698 times
IMG_0987.jpg
IMG_0987.jpg (322.15 KiB) Viewed 698 times
IMG_0986.jpg
IMG_0986.jpg (309.56 KiB) Viewed 698 times

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LateDateMorganGuy
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by LateDateMorganGuy » Sun Sep 06, 2020 4:00 pm

Looks like strike doubling on the mint mark.

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PacificWR
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by PacificWR » Sun Sep 06, 2020 6:12 pm

Can you take some photos of the right side of the obverse, back of the cap, top of the cap, forehead and nose? In addition, do you see any die cracks in the lower hair. On the reverse can you list the die cracks?

Dirtdoctor
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by Dirtdoctor » Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:05 pm

I took the full coin pics with Iphone. Have to break out gear to get better quality pics. Can do that but it would take a bit; all that is put up. See if attached enlargement works for you. Appreciate the time.

On the reverse, the die cracks are much less pronounced. Going clockwise:
  • Small crack along top of "nite"
    Bottom of E thru D, thru wing to upper part of S
    Bottom of "STATES O"
    Top of "TES OF"
    Middle of "F" thru wing to bottom of "A"
    Top of "MERI"
Thanks
Attachments
Bonnet.jpg
Bonnet.jpg (253.69 KiB) Viewed 667 times
IMG_0984.jpg
IMG_0984.jpg (327.97 KiB) Viewed 667 times

Dirtdoctor
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by Dirtdoctor » Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:12 pm

I don't see anything in lower hair. Pic via Celestron scope attached.
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Lower Hair.jpg
Lower Hair.jpg (284.73 KiB) Viewed 665 times

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LateDateMorganGuy
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by LateDateMorganGuy » Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:16 pm

Where ever this post is headed, rest assured that this exact die pair in earlier die states does not have a doubled mint mark.

jgrinz
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by jgrinz » Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:23 pm

I find these pictures tough to work with
that being said it all boils down to a NEAR SLANTED date looks to be have upper side of NORMAL position for the MM
Maybe a LDS of one of those variations is what we have here?
though it is quite worn check for all the die markers for those any of the listed known 'breaks'
Definitely a cool amount of cracks on this puppy
good luck
Image

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PacificWR
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by PacificWR » Sun Sep 06, 2020 9:04 pm

LateDateMorganGuy wrote:
Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:16 pm
Where ever this post is headed, rest assured that this exact die pair in earlier die states does not have a doubled mint mark.
Alan is right here. Is there anyway you can check the date for doubling on the x900? My die study has shown there are at least several undocumented 1900-S Morgan Dollars with a slanted date.

Dirtdoctor
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by Dirtdoctor » Sun Sep 06, 2020 11:59 pm

I'd checked VAM 14 and did not see a match. Base of 1 sloped on V14. Top of 0's rounded. The wing-neck gap scratches (see pic) are not the same on this coin, and I don't see the cap scratch. Date closeup attached.

I'd gone through the listed breaks and did not see any with cracks/breaks as pronounced around the date and the left stars as this coin.

There is a break in the hair-Vee but I don't see other matches to 18a (date location wrong, break different). Picture attached.

I will break out digital camera and macro lens and get much better quality pics.
Attachments
Date Closeup.jpg
Date Closeup.jpg (216.86 KiB) Viewed 624 times
C3 Reverse.jpg
C3 Reverse.jpg (254.49 KiB) Viewed 624 times
Hair V break.jpg
Hair V break.jpg (204.49 KiB) Viewed 624 times

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PacificWR
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by PacificWR » Mon Sep 07, 2020 12:08 am

Thank you that should be a great help.

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LateDateMorganGuy
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by LateDateMorganGuy » Mon Sep 07, 2020 12:29 am

Until it was revised, your coin would have fit into the VAM-12 family.

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PacificWR
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by PacificWR » Mon Sep 07, 2020 1:28 am

Dirtdoctor wrote:
Sun Sep 06, 2020 11:59 pm
I'd checked VAM 14 and did not see a match. Base of 1 sloped on V14. Top of 0's rounded. The wing-neck gap scratches (see pic) are not the same on this coin, and I don't see the cap scratch. Date closeup attached.

I'd gone through the listed breaks and did not see any with cracks/breaks as pronounced around the date and the left stars as this coin.

There is a break in the hair-Vee but I don't see other matches to 18a (date location wrong, break different). Picture attached.

I will break out digital camera and macro lens and get much better quality pics.
Just a few more things. Can you check on the die crack in field by the lower hair. It should run into the lower hair. In addition, the die crack from the left side of the lower neck should run above the top of the first left star. Does it touch the second left star? Finally, the die crack from the right lower side of the neck that runs to the 1 and though the 9 in the date can you take some close-up photos? Thanks.

Dirtdoctor
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by Dirtdoctor » Mon Sep 07, 2020 1:40 pm

Attached are better quality pics. I cannot see the hair-vee crack running into the hair. It is less pronounced than others.

Thanks for your time and interest.

Hope this helps.
Attachments
1900 S Date.JPG
1900 S Date.JPG (148.29 KiB) Viewed 599 times
1900 S Stars.JPG
1900 S Stars.JPG (194.3 KiB) Viewed 599 times
1900 S MM Closeup 2.jpg
1900 S MM Closeup 2.jpg (222.4 KiB) Viewed 599 times
1900 S Obverse.jpg
1900 S Obverse.jpg (299.81 KiB) Viewed 599 times
1900 S Reverse.JPG
1900 S Reverse.JPG (260.16 KiB) Viewed 599 times

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PacificWR
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by PacificWR » Mon Sep 07, 2020 4:01 pm

Thanks for the additional photos. Have you ever submitted a package to LVA?

Dirtdoctor
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by Dirtdoctor » Mon Sep 07, 2020 4:40 pm

No I have not. I've had a couple I thought could be submittals, but I when I ran them by this board, only one was suggested as worthwhile, and I never did send it.

Geseas
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by Geseas » Mon Sep 07, 2020 5:23 pm

/permissions/to use this post as pattern for any 'Submission'. Thanks. (A person may learn something here)
Last edited by Geseas on Mon Sep 07, 2020 5:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Dirtdoctor
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by Dirtdoctor » Mon Sep 07, 2020 5:45 pm

Sorry, I'm lost there. Where do I enter "/permissions"?

Geseas
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by Geseas » Mon Sep 07, 2020 5:56 pm

Thanks @dirtdoctor . I appreciate your photography! I have this new computer now. On a learning curve...I will eventually get it. Was your last photo with your digital camera?

Dirtdoctor
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by Dirtdoctor » Mon Sep 07, 2020 6:43 pm

All of the last 5 were with Nikon Digital D7200 and macro lens, NEF format. I then transfer pics to computer and convert to reasonable sized jpg image with photoshop to send.

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PacificWR
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Re: 1900 S tripled S, Die Breaks Date

Post by PacificWR » Mon Sep 07, 2020 7:47 pm

In order to submit your coins to LVA go to the VAMWorld home page and scroll to the link "Guidelines for New VAM Varieties"
and just follow the instructions. Link is below.

[http://ec2-13-58-222-16.us-east-2.compu ... _Varieties]

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