81-O February Examination of VAMs 30, 37, 37A, 37B, and 59

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HawkeEye
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81-O February Examination of VAMs 30, 37, 37A, 37B, and 59

Post by HawkeEye » Sun Mar 01, 2020 7:57 pm

This month we dug down into the five VAMs with the "Double Reverse Legend and Motto" description to see if we could sort out what is and isn't common to these VAMs. This was a lot of coins and a lot of time under the microscope, and it isn't over. We are doing the die crack analysis on these five VAMs and they do begin to sort themselves out.

But it will take the month of March to finish up on this group and reach some final conclusions. Of particular interest has become the definition of the term "Beveled Field" and just where on the reverse this occurs. What constitutes enough doubling to earn the title of "Doubled Reverse Legend and Motto" is also a topic for discussion.

As usual the die cracks help us greatly, but there is a lot more to study here.

Enjoy http://www.1881o.com/2020-02.html and stay tuned for some conclusions in March.
Deep in the woods of North Georgia

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UncleGildy
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Re: 81-O February Examination of VAMs 30, 37, 37A, 37B, and 59

Post by UncleGildy » Sun Mar 29, 2020 3:20 am

Just read the Feb issue of The 1881-O, and really enjoy the way HawkeEye performs these Analyses with a level head and clear methodology.

Just a few months back I ran across a VAM-37A, and weeks later a coin that I thought would be a VAM-37. But I could clearly see it was once a 37A, with most of of the clash marks polished away. Cool coin, and as Andy and HawkeEye pointed out - since there were no new listable attributes to the die state, it will just revert back to VAM-37. Interesting. And then I got my VAM-37B and and a true VAM-37 with no polished-away clash marks, and started seeing much of what's covered in HaweEye's Feb article.

As mentioned there, I see the beveling on the other coins too, but the beveling on the 37B seems just a little more steep (no gradual build up of the ramp).

Interestingly, there are a couple other minor cracks on my coins which show up in the photos of some of the 1881-O inventory.

My 37B which matches DCO2 and also has a crack through the end of Liberty's nose and a crack from the top of the cotton leaf to the wheat leaves.
Nose+Leaf2Leaf-On-DCO2.jpg
Nose+Leaf2Leaf-On-DCO2.jpg (72.6 KiB) Viewed 172 times
I see this on two of the 37Bs on the 1881-O.

My 37, 37A and 37A-reverted-to-37 all match DCO3 and exhibit a crack extending down from Liberty's hair above the forehead (under L in PLURIBUS).
HairFront-On-DCO3.jpg
HairFront-On-DCO3.jpg (26.95 KiB) Viewed 172 times
I only see hint of this crack on a few of The 1881-O VAM-37Bs. I see it in the 37A's but not the VAM-37's at the 1881-O. But we all know how slight cracks like these can hide in photos due to lighting etc.

Just to be clear, I don't mean to muddy the waters or suggest these differentiate a separate group or subgroup or anything. They are probably nothing more than advanced stage samples of the later die states. Just secondary minor cracks, but I found them interesting and they were consistent between those DCO2 and DCO3 groups on my four coins from the 37 series.

Thanks for the great work and very enjoyable website!

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HawkeEye
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Re: 81-O February Examination of VAMs 30, 37, 37A, 37B, and 59

Post by HawkeEye » Sun Mar 29, 2020 2:38 pm

Well let's don't rule out that you found something, but this month is a mess trying to relocate family members and work with others. If I do a newsletter it will be late. I have it about half done but just had to stop for higher priorities.

The die crack down through the nose is visible on VAM 27 https://www.1881o.com/assets/81ov40-974 ... cracks.jpg
And 1H https://www.1881o.com/assets/81ov1h-049 ... cracks.jpg

We are always looking for hints as to physical die utilization and the sequence of use. It could be that 27, 1H, and these are in some sequence that requires further analysis.

So "hold that thought" is in order and when I can I will get back to this.
Deep in the woods of North Georgia

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UncleGildy
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Re: 81-O February Examination of VAMs 30, 37, 37A, 37B, and 59

Post by UncleGildy » Sun Mar 29, 2020 4:32 pm

Most certainly. The month of March has thrown curve balls at everyone and their plans. I hope all is well with the family there!

Wow, I never even considered the 1H crack through the end of the nose. I have my 1H handy and was able to compare. In my case I can say that, although they look really similar, the 1H starts out a little closer to the end of the nose and at a different angle. It's much easier to see in hand, but they certainly are different. Here's a poor attempt to trace the differences in trajectory between 1H and 37B.
1H+37B_Nose.jpg
1H+37B_Nose.jpg (60.77 KiB) Viewed 145 times
Wish I had a VAM-27 to help, but I can at suggest the 1H appears to be different on my VAMs for what it's worth.

Hang in there, and don't feel any pressure for any news letters.

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HawkeEye
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Re: 81-O February Examination of VAMs 30, 37, 37A, 37B, and 59

Post by HawkeEye » Sun Mar 29, 2020 6:47 pm

My apologies, I said VAM 27 and was looking at a reference for Obverse Die 27. It is VAM 40

Check here https://www.1881o.com/vam01hmatrix.html and here https://www.1881o.com/vam40matrix.html

I was about to all these two the same and then discovered on my VAM 40 examples a little gem you will see on the VAM 40 page
Deep in the woods of North Georgia

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UncleGildy
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Re: 81-O February Examination of VAMs 30, 37, 37A, 37B, and 59

Post by UncleGildy » Sun Mar 29, 2020 7:20 pm

Oh, now that's cool! A little GEM indeed. I was convinced they were the same too, and I see VAM-1H and VAM-40's all the time on the bay. But I've never acquired more than the one Lioncutter sold me about a year ago, 'cause it's pretty common and I already have one. Mine's in an older ANACS MS64 which I logged as VAM-1H, and as you can see below, it may have to be relabeled VAM-40 now.

Nice discovery! Maybe we can keep both varieties after all.
1881O_1374007b.jpg
1881O_1374007b.jpg (287.31 KiB) Viewed 140 times

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HawkeEye
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Re: 81-O February Examination of VAMs 30, 37, 37A, 37B, and 59

Post by HawkeEye » Sun Mar 29, 2020 8:54 pm

I have not updated this page yet, but this is the look of the denticles when they have the ejection error

https://www.1881o.com/clashed-denticles.html
Deep in the woods of North Georgia

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